In a nutshell: yes.

Intereresting discussion.
According to W3C:

The FIELDSET element allows authors to group thematically related controls and labels.

So generally I would agree with you.

In a situation where you may wish to have a text input for First Name and a text input for Last Name on different lines, I would use:

<p><label for="firstname">First Name:</label><input id="firstname" name="firstname" type="text" /></p>

<p><label for="lastname">Last Name:</label><input id="lastname" name="lastname" type="text" /></p>

It would not have been necessary to wrap a fieldset element around each of the two input elements but it might be useful to wrap the two of them together inside one fieldset element with a legend of Name (or something like that). As I understand it, the purpose of the fieldset element is to group related fields.

I also believe that the fieldset element should group radio buttons, checkboxes and possibly select lists (I just thought of this so I will have to consider it more) but I don’t think the fieldset element is needed to wrap around a single text input.

Yeah, I got my wires crossed…

Prisca,

Absolutely, war is not a good word for it.

Chris,

The term web standards is used because it has become the common way for people to label the W3C specifications; of course it is, in practicality, recommendations.

I’ve worked with companies who have gotten ISO certifications so I definitely know what you’re talking about. I would welcome ISO standardization for web browsers vendors, unless such a tedious process becomes to complex and holds back web browser development which then in turn will harm web developers and end users alike.

For now, the small demand is for web developers to follow the W3C specifications to make sure web sites work and can reach as many end users as possible.

Here are two excellent articles on why it remains important for web developers who are int […]

a p within an input element

The INPUT element type is defined as EMPTY. It cannot have any content at all. It’s also an inline element, so even if it could, you couldn’t put a block-level paragraph inside it.

I suppose you meant it the other way round: an input element within a p. Just me being facetious … it’s Friday after all.

Ah, now I see! Sloppy, sloppy Robert. Having a p within an input element is very bad.

Ed,

Very valid points. I would say, though, that most web sites with invalid code have it because the web developers lack the necessary skills to accomplish it or they are just lazy. But of course there is some validation frenzy out there as well, that sometimes go overboard…

And the interim phase you mention seem to be very common. It usually means that they’re at least trying, and I guess it’s ok as long they keep on evolving on to proper semantic code.

Heated debates can be be good and contain good information, but they often just end up taking focus from the more important things.

Jennifer,

I would say that people who write such comments usually hasn’t yet learned all the benefits of semantic code and CSS-based layouts. I think it’s important to educate them about what they can and can’t do. Maybe my article CSS shortcomings can be of assistance?

Take it to the blogs or Web sites where they aren’t using standards-based design, and talk to them.

Definitely. As long as people just preach to the choir, we don’t reach any more people. I try to explain the benefits and the necessity of web standards to any web developer or customer I come across.

But! I post about this regularly on my site, and find a lot of resistance to the idea of Web standards. For example, when I linked to the Vitamin article yesterday, I received the following comment:

My customer dont care if the website is layed out in tables or CSS. The end product is that the page can be seen in all browser correctly. Tables is a layout tool and I still use them, but use CSS as well.

I get that type of feedback all the time. “Tables is a layout tool.” I struggle with that. And in some ways, I understand them - CSS is hard, especially if you’ve spent 2-4 years learning tables. I don’t agree with them, but I understand why they wouldn’t want to spend more time fighting with CSS when they’ve finally got table-based design working for them.

If you’re going to evangelize standards-based design, then you need to really evangelize it. Take it to the blogs or Web sites where they aren’t using standards-based design, and talk to them. (And before you tell me that About isn’t standards-based, I know… I write articles for them, I don’t build their site.)

Jenn